origins of chanuka
interesting guest post by lurker on dovbear's blog
"This, in turn, brings to mind the question of the origins of Hanukah. Interestingly, Hanukah also coincides with the Winter Solstice period. More significantly, it is eight days long – just like Saturnalia was. Was this a historical accident, or is there more significance to the time and length of this holiday? Were the Christians the only ones to adapt Saturnalia to their own needs? Or Does Hanukah, too, bear a connection to this ancient Solstice festival? DovBear says that there is indeed such a connection. Is he right?"
pls pardon poor typing--2 broken wrists
update dec 25, 2008
lots of interesting discussion in comments 2 that post. recommend u read comments
"This, in turn, brings to mind the question of the origins of Hanukah. Interestingly, Hanukah also coincides with the Winter Solstice period. More significantly, it is eight days long – just like Saturnalia was. Was this a historical accident, or is there more significance to the time and length of this holiday? Were the Christians the only ones to adapt Saturnalia to their own needs? Or Does Hanukah, too, bear a connection to this ancient Solstice festival? DovBear says that there is indeed such a connection. Is he right?"
pls pardon poor typing--2 broken wrists
update dec 25, 2008
lots of interesting discussion in comments 2 that post. recommend u read comments
posted by Shira Salamone at 8:45 PM
8 Comments:
Every ancient religion recognized the Winter Solstice. One of the interesting things, IMO, about Torah Judaism is the LACK of a Winter Solstice holiday... Chanukah is a much later addition... It's interesting in that our holidays are tied entirely to the agricultural process not astronomical events.
That said, no doubt that parts of the Jewish people adopted various pagan practices regarding the winter solstice (lights are generally a part of recognizing the darkness). However, I think that one would be better off looking into middle eastern pagan rituals to find an origin for conveniently scheduling a holiday then.
Tying the 8 days in... well, modern American Jews have put Chanukah into competition with Christmas, so why wouldn't we assume that our ancestors had the same guy reaction.
"One of the interesting things, IMO, about Torah Judaism is the LACK of a Winter Solstice holiday... Chanukah is a much later addition..."
interesting point. chanukah such a late addition, & so little liked by the rabbis of old, that the books of maccabees don't even appear in jewish bible--they were preserved by the catholic church
Right... Also, been learning a little Chanukah Halacha... it's a strange little holiday, with some rules that are in theory very rigid (lighting time, etc.), and rules that are very strange (restrictions during the candle burning).
The timing of Chanukah with the Winter Solstice is not a coincidence, IMO, and clearly Chazal was co-opting something, trying to control it.
Interesting though, that it survived and thrived, while other holidays have not remained relevant.
Who does ANYTHING for Pesach Sheini (second Pesach, one day one month later, a second chance to offer the Pesach offering)... supposedly some have a custom of eating Matza again, since it's Chag Hamatzot Sheini.
Tu B'av has completely died, though we may see Israel build it into enough of a "Hallmark Holiday" to get some traction.
Yom Hatzmaut and Yom Yerusalayim are way too young to evaluate, but I would guess that their staying power will be minor if appropriate liturgy and customs aren't adapted. There need to be customs that people DO for the holiday to having staying power.
Hence the decline of Shavuot... it's "observed" by Observant Jews, in that they take two days off of work and do the Yom Tov thing, but it's not observed by the non-Frum Jews at all (who do usually observe Chanukah, and practicing ones observe Purim in some regard)... Chazal didn't give it appropriate post-Temple ritual, and the Rabbis of the middle ages got rid of the activities (decorating the Synagogue in branches, which could have extended to the home), combined with the Omer "quasi morning" period that ties Shavuot in with an annoying period to make it less fun.
Hell, look at how Lag B'omer, a minor even characterized with delayed weddings and hair cuts by Ashkenazi Europe, has become a big celebratory event in Israel that is spreading to the US.
Something that the Jewish leadership used to understand: if the people do stuff, they remember it. If they "learn stuff," they forget it. I think that next year for Shavuot, I'm joining a Sephardi friend, they seem to have a real neat night of learning, that seems more fun than sitting around for boring Shiurim and drinking coffee.
I mean, honestly, there is nothing to do on the second day of Shavuot but try to readjust your schedule. Look at how the second day of Shemini Atzeret become important and even enhanced by the addition of Simchat Torah then, in many ways trumping the day with a new meaning.
"Something that the Jewish leadership used to understand: if the people do stuff, they remember it. If they "learn stuff," they forget it."
i think ur absolutely right about shavuot. by comparison 2 sukkot, it's way too low-key--it's hard 2 base a whole celebration around studying torah (which many traditional jews do every day) & eating cheesecake
Of course the timing is not a coincidence. Moreover, all of our holidays are tied to both astronomical and agricultural events.
Chanukah, by definition, straddles the new moon of Tevet, which is always the darkest time of year--the time of least moon around the time of longest darkness on the solar cycle.
(This is a theme I have written about quite a lot, specifically on the agricultural connections, starting with my Chanukah 'planting' of 2006.)
All of our major (and some not so major) holidays are determined not only by the moon cycle (Rosh haShannah at the new moon, Pesach at the full, etc.), but also by the solar cycle (i.e. with leap years to keep our holidays from drifting out their ag-relevant seasons).
It is interesting that there was no wintertime festival defined in the Torah, but any connection to Saturnalia would seemingly have to be very indirect. (Was there an ancient Greek equivalent? I do not know.)
I have always found an even more interesting question to be why Judaism lacks a holiday around the summer solstice.
from avishalom's tu b'av link in his comment 2 my next post, puzzled about xmas:
"reasons why there is no festival around the summer solstice: for an ancient monotheistic society being weaned off paganism, there are no significant “other gods” temptations at this time of year, as there are in fall, winter, and spring."
I've heard an argument made that links Hanukkah's eight days to the observances of Sukkot and Shemini Atzeret. While I haven't myself vetted the line of though, the argument asserts that Sukkot and the prayers for rain were among the signal holidays of the time, so the priests performed these observances to rededicate the Temple.
As well, is there any reason to think that the Hanukkah story DIDN'T coincide with 25 Kislev? Why search for a reason to attach Hanukkah to other winter rites if there is no need?
"is there any reason to think that the Hanukkah story DIDN'T coincide with 25 Kislev? Why search for a reason to attach Hanukkah to other winter rites if there is no need?"
some of us think there's a need 2 search for a reason because so many religions celebrate winter solstice that some folks feel it's more than a coincidence
to all, whatever ur interpretation, i hope u had a happy & meaningful chanukah
pray 4 israel's soldiers
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